Bigfoot, Bears, & Bull Sh*t

Views and opinions expressed by the guests of Sasquatch Experience do not necessarily reflect the opinion of the host, sponsors, or affiliates of the Sasquatch Experience. As always, listener discretion is advised. We got some one or something rolling around out here. You see what it was? Was it a person or an animal? Or I can't know. I know that my underway came on and I did happened to Glenn be the thing running. Across the good Bye man? Nothing looked by the men. I don't know what it was. Back in two thousand and five, we set out with one goal to give voice to the mystery and those who pursue it. Sasquatch Experience Podcast has been your go to source for serious Bigfoot discussion, where we separate fact from folklore. Always grounded in research and respect. We've interviewed eye witnesses experts since skeptic like because understanding Bigfoot isn't just about belief, It's about the journey. Nearly two decades later, we're still chasing shadows and sharing stories. The search never stopped. Welcome to the Sasquatch Experience. Hello, get somebody out here, and good evening, everybody, Monday, November twenty fourth, twenty twenty five. Turkey Week is upon us and we are excited for our Thanksgiving. I'm Sean FKA. That's Vance Nez, but he's James Baker. Three out of five aim bad tonight, and we're gonna have kind of an open mic off the cuff show tonight, calling it Bigfoot, Bears and Bosh as we're going to kind of talk about what's on our mind regarding what's you know, recent happening. So gentlemen, good evening and welcome. Good to see. I know it's been a couple of weeks since we last engaged, but we've all been incredibly busy doing one thing or another. Latest episode of Sasquatch Sasquatch Investigation Bigfoot on Small Town Monsters is out going on right now, which in this episode we introduced Jeff and Julie Anderson, Paul Bogden and other individuals that are out there on the quest for Bigfoot out in the Alleghany National Forest. So go over to Smalltown Monsters dot com or small Town Monsters dot com or small Town Monsters on YouTube and check it out. And Vance, I don't know if you've had a chance to watch it yet, but interested in here I have your opinions on. That, Oh, I have, and I find it rather intriguing, and I think intriguing is the big point in all of this. I would kick this open mic show off with a couple of points regarding small town monsters. If our audience has not had a chance to go to Siege of Ape Canyon yet, I encourage you to do that. But there's a couple of points I want to bring up on that entire topic. It's a really good documentary and yeah, it's very good, and I would start with, you know, a great thank you to Mark Matsel who did a lot of investigating into what the encompassed of where the happen was built, where this whole situation happened at. Now there's five. There are five different I would say events that have happened in vintage Bigfoot. This is one of them. This story has always intrigued me and for Mark Masel to go out and he did eventually find some physical evidence of where the cabin where this event happened at. And I don't want to jump too far ahead because I don't want to ruin it. For anybody. But if you follow through with the story, these guys did not have a whole lot of cash dollars to their pocket to build something. As far as the cabin goes under Osha, you know, there was no foundation. Yeah, right, there was no foundation. There was minimal amount of hardware to put this cabin together. So when he did find nails and a saw blade and some binding wire or banding wire rather, that represented where this cabin may have been. I have five different points, and I want to throw four of them out there and maybe get yours and James' fifth interjection into my opinion. Sure, I would say that the siege, the Siege of Ape Canyon has an interesting aspect because of the fact of it's called Ape Canyon. Why that was never brought up in the documentary. I've watched it twice. It was never brought up in the documentary as to why it's referred to Ape Canyon. Now, a lot of things are named for what they are, like Boggy Creek for example, Boggy Creek, Well, that's understandable. It's a marshland around a creek, very boggy. Uh, that's understandable. But Ape Canyon never really defined where that term came from. Uh, well, if you're going to consider the fact that apes did not live in the North American continent, why did we name it Ape Canyon? It was named Abe Canyon after the incident. I understand that, right. It wasn't called ad Canyon before. It was named eight Canyon after the after the incident. I am trying to find a way to justify what it was without looking crazy. Right, And I think when they do the description of these things, it's model does an ape, So you know, put two and two together Ape Canyon. But it still brings a lot of legitimacy to the experience in what these gentlemen did have at that time. You know, like I said, going back to the cabin, when they built this cabin, they built it for a shelter for their equipment on the off season. I'm certain to the fact that they probably did not have every aspect of hardware to make this cabin last for years and years. Most likely not. I'm sure it was done on a minimal budget and it could have fallen down and rotted away. That makes sense. Mark Bncel in the documentary of Siege of a Canyon to come across the artifacts in which he did is extraor ramely profound to me that I think he did find where this cabin once stayed because it wasn't built on a foundation. I think it was just built as a shelter. I think we firmly agree that's the spot they found. I don't have any questions about that. And I think it. Goes back to people with translatable skills. You know, Mark had experience as a surveyor and being able to take those and get roundabout ideas and use you know, logical thinking and deduction to come. To the reasoning of where this place was. I think is very you know, very critical as to why we we meet people with different backgrounds to join up into this field. This is a perfect example of that. We're able to take some of our most basic folklore, you know, a lot of the intro introductory stories into the cascading and excitement a big foot, and they're able to put some more legitimacy to it. You know, you're talking about a canyon, ye get its name. You know, we go back to these threes and the genesis of all these things. I think it's great and we can actually prove that they were physical places that actually these things happened. And it's that in itself is you know, pretty slam dunk and I other than you know, probably naming it for something they experienced. You know, there's a lot of places vans that have names that I don't Devil's Elbow, uh, spook Hollow, A lot of places that have these names that you know are probably named after some sort of experience that folks have had there. Or you know, there's some other places too that have some very negative names. I'm not going to say, but you know, just for you know, traditions at the time. Oh, stop it, Wow, listen to you. We're gonna have Hey, I gotta interject here somewhere. Say it again. Yeah, if murdered, get murdered for wearing white after labored. Sial, Mom, check it out. Then put your next point on that one. Well, my point is there's five vintage stories that I find very enthralling to reality to this effect, and I will leave the fifth one for the three of us to give at least our opinion of. One of them is Boggy Creek. Uh. You know, everything that happened at Boggy Creek. I find that very compelling and a lot of it true. The next one would be the Albert Ottsman story. I find that really and then I'm just going to jump right into the Patterson Gimlin film. I think that entire story with some film evidence, I find that very compelling and to be true. But I'll leave the fifth one up to you, guys, because I have my fifth. But I want to leave it up to you, too, guys, to throw what you think would be the fifth story to be the most compelling in a vintage Bigfoot story. Oh, I definitely go to the William Rowe encounter. Okay. Probably also I would throw Ruby Creek in there. I would probably because I don't consider Boggy Creek to be vintage, because that's even still towards the middle of the century, right, seventies. In the seventies, right, I consider that vintage, right. Well, you know I should because of you know, my relation to the timeline. But when I think of that, I go back to William Rowe, Albert Ausman, these nineteen twenty to nineteen sixties stories, you know that really kind of set the stage for the big Foot mania that would follow. And we did a whole couple episodes on Ruby Creek of folks want to go back. It was our Monsterfest live show that we did where we really talked about the Ruby Creek incident. But then also again Albert Ousman, and there's a lot of contention on Albert Osman, did that really happen? I think that man, there's so much that was going on in that story. He had to be really bored to make that up and where would he think? So? But where did he get that creative edge from? Because humans really aren't that creative. Yeah, you know, we take things that we learn and we observe and we kind of make them in the stories. Very rarely do we just pull a whole new idea out of the air and say, oh, look for Frugenschnaugen. You know, like no, no, I totally get it right, And I think I totally get that. Did Osman embellish some of it? Perhaps, But I think for the core of it, the Osman situation really happened. You know, if we threw Boggy Creek in their dvance, I would very much agree that the Boggy Creek was an incredibly interesting area, definitely had some sort of cryptozoological situation going on, and I think it still perpetuates in that area today. I don't think I do too, because really, the folk monster, fouk monster has gone off anywhere. Patterson, Gimblin, I'm on the fence for for many different reasons. As soon as I want to dismiss it, something else comes in my way and wants to give me more credence. And I met Bob Gimblin. You know, he's a nice guy. But again, you could be the nicest guy and still be able to pull the wool over people's eyes. Has nothing to do with being nice. Right, No, no, no, it's it's the initial gut reaction. Go ahead, James, what's that big? But I think we've had this discussion a few times, and the fact is you have to look at it in a way that even if he lied, and Patterson lied, and everybody lied, and the horses lied, you know, and the video was made on a foreign studio next to the moon landing, whatever lies you want to go with at the end of the day, is that the only piece of evidence you have to hold to the theory Like, I've never seen the Locknest monster, but I also have talked to many people that are way smarter than me read all the books, looked into it and go, oh hey, it might be eels, or it might be a Leopleuridon, magic leop anyway, but they I just think that what the bigfoot thing. We always have these big conversations about whether whether this sighting was real or this sighting was real, And all we're trying to do is get an idea of what other people saw, to kind of get a collective idea, and also to create, you know, to collect evidence. Like you and I say it all the time, Sean. You know, we may not have seen a deer on the land, but if I got hoof marks and droppings and my corn is eaten, I can put those together and say deer now with. You can build the case. You could build a case from ancillary evidence like I got all this thing. You're right right right, and. You've got to make sure that you don't go too white off. Oh hey, it's it's got to be this, or it's got to be that. No, no, no. You take the evidence and then from there you go, Okay, I know there's a deer within let's say five hundred yards. Okay, let's look around, get more evidence, and eventually you've got to get a point where they catch something that looks like a deer, or you've just been wasting five months of your time looking at a piece of land. I mean, I want to show you something, Baker, just because you said evidence. And it was something that Matt had sent to me earlier today that he wanted us to go over before he, you know, needed to arrest his Sciattica. We hope Matt gets better here soon. And of course Henry's not here tonight because of really bad weather going on down in Mississippi, so we want our friends to be safe. I'm trying to pull he's getting some nasties. Yeah, they got some bad storm through tonight. Yep. Potential nocturnal tornadoes from what I understand, yep, yeah. Nocturnal winded missions. Yeah, you are kind of what you experienced in the middle of the night. Yes, I see that picture there. It's more now that just kind of took up the whole this was Why can't I get it to display in a great way? Why did it have to be a schmuck? Where are we? Let's get us back to a way. I have a schmuck too, But that's okay. Well, that's where that nocturnal mis game. Anyhow, if I could figure out to use this damn thing, this would be a picture. What's that look like to you guys? Clearly I see bear tracks in there, right, I can't make it out. I just see I just see footprints of whatever sort. I can't make that out specifically. But it's funny you say that, because that's the point what we clearly have here or overlays of bear tracks stepping into bear tracks, and how they make these you know, bigfoot like footprints, right and that and that happens and we start talking about things like that secondary evidence that we were just talking. Yeah, the rear foot falls into the fun foot. Yeah, understandable. We go to bake example of what he was saying. Of, you know, you can't prove a deer was there, because we could prove a deer was there because we have droppings, we have footprints, and we have sample. Right, there's a perfect example of somebody could say there was a bigfoot there, but de're just completely misinterpreting the the data. Mm hmm. Understandable. And it's not saying that like I and I didn't realize that a deer is a stupid analogy in a way, but it's not because the fact is that we know deer exist. You can go to you can go to a deer penning zoo, you can go to deer Ascic Park, which is a place there's help for. We didn't see any deer deer Ascic Park, which was weird. But we did see Meldrum before he passed. He we actually have certificates of him showing us how to make casts. It's one of my best. Kurt makes a good point here with it. But the fact is, you know, with all the people that say that people in suits are costumes, are kids out in the woods making those structures. That would be more amazed if that than actual bigfoot people are too lazy to do all that today. Yeah, I agree, Kurt Hurt. I think that is an apt I think maybe years ago people were a lot more venturous to go out and do things to hoax. Now people are too freaking lazy to do it. Lazy And he's got a he had commentary on that picture. I showed toes look like bear paws, but yeah, toes didn't look long enough. I would say double bear print. Yeah, and when you look at him there's actually a and I'll try to load it up. Oh shit, hit myself with the microphone. There's a long series of trails going through that which you could clearly see are our bear prints that are stepping into each other. But if you only saw the inlay of the of the feet stepping. On one another, you could really you could. That could fool people. Oh sure, that could absolutely yep. I agree. You know. I would go back because I stated to you Sean and James, five vintage evidence stories, a vintage evidence stories, and I would throw the fifth one in to leave it up to you guys to throw what you thought your fifth one was. But I would say the Paul Freeman, the video footage from him. What makes Freeman compelling for me is there goes right. I think there was some genuine reaction to that. And I spoke with Mike Freeman. And when you speak to a son who pretty much who pretty well knows his dad, he get an idea of what the man was like at him right right. There's a lot of questions as to some of Freeman's evidence, and that's a shameful thing because sometimes it does taint the overall, you know, image that somebody has the reputation of somebody. But I think at the whole what he brought us was legitimate, and I think that video is a solid video. I really I do too. I think when he came across the footprints and was started to follow them, and his reaction and his gut reaction, and then when he actually saw the creature, I feel within my gut that that was a genuine reaction to something he experienced as real. I think the problem is, as with a lot of these videos, people go in and take liberties. Oh it's lifting up a baby. And oh yeah, right right. I don't start circle and I don't really care. What I start caring about is the ability to uh, you know, see the intentional object that's there in front of us that we can see and make out that I care about. And so can we get adding things to uh to videos to try to make them more credible? It actually just makes us seem more bullshit and crazy, right, I don't know. Yeah, And we need to talk about bears and bullshit. You make a perfect example, is you know, with bears and with the other things. Is that the problem is is that it seems like we had a sighting of something very strange, and we go back to our dear story, but we had a sighting of very something strange. We may augment to what we remember and we talk amongst ourselves and we add little points, but we don't say, magically, an alien sucked up the body, you know. And a lot of that comes from people stop listening, right, or people stuff or us up getting calls for hey, can you do this conference? Hey can you do this conference? That's why a lot of when you said, like the five points of why you would believe in a supernatural creature or even a cryptid creature, the main reason I believe in a lot of these cryptid creatures have nothing to do with anything that happened before the eighteen hundreds or after the eighteen hundreds, because, honestly, when people thought you were crazy for seeing something in the woods, you didn't tell these stories to everybody, right, The Indians didn't tell the stories to everybody. They only tell the stories to something, to some of the passer bys, and hey, by the way, there's a strange creature in the woods. It's not negative. They would share the tribe themselves, right right, Yeah. Some of it. Yeah, they were poking at the white man, why not he sucks, you know, but not all of them, you know. And they weren't running around the woods with with well, they were running around woods with Deren bearhead, but that was a whole other problem. But they weren't running around the woods faking sightings for all the Pilgrims and ship like that. They were just living their life and going by the way. There's some other creatures that you might not be aware of that are out right too, you know, because we didn't know what Orne was until they explained it. Take a hike and wow, wow, you know, the other day I was going to get. Deer tick ticks suck, no pun intended. I don't know about stone picker, but thanks for tuning in. Even if you're. They're hard to find when they're on your butt. You would think would be easy because not looking for those ticks. Larry said that I always thought the head looked a little smallish and round as it sits on the top of the shoulders. And you know, that's one thing I think that makes the The Freeman film a little different is it's proportions. It's a lot more barrel chested than the Patty creature. Right, But again, let's take a look at the difference of sexuality between the two. Was one male and one female? That's we're not allowed to assume it's gender, well, but we should scientifically. Let's take a look at the gender. Well, now, Patty had breasts. Yes, Now listen, listen, the I just did devil horns. Now we're going to be accused of something else. Listen, squash titt. The details not there enough to determine the gender of the Freeman creature, right, I mean it's it's VHS and it's pretty. The quality of it's. Oh, it's horrible, I get it. But you can still see the movement of it. Yeah, well listen, it's very large and lumbering. That's what makes that different than Patty. Patty kind of lighted. You notice if it had a slan. Now, Patty had breasts, babe, if I there's no question about that. I think we can all agree that Patty had breast Yep, yep, did you say Patty long? Wow? Good god, Wow, this is an adult show. The night or what to take a break here? Oh? No, you know, a couple of nuys. Take the nights off and the show goes to the birds. Anyhow, we'll be back and just you know, a couple of minutes as I'm very confused and. The brain damage, yeah, I get it, I'm brain damaged. To Larry, Joe was chiming in. I think Freeman was a female too. Cliff went to the site and took measurements and Kurt h Patty, I think had breast and the muscled definition is why he thinks it's real and egg plant all right, and guys stay with us as we come back. Sasquatch experience. Sean Floker, Vince and has been James Acre. Right after this the big football Hoorn news. Steve I Simb. Tell my kids about Thanksgiving a couple of months ago and they're like, what's the deal with Thanksgiving? I'm like, oh, Thanksgiving. The Pilgrims going to America and they didn't know how to have any food or any place of lips to the Indians saw them how to hunt and farm and build houses. And my kids are like, wow, that's really nice of them. What happened to the Indians? We got rid of them? Why did we do that? Because they didn't any their vegetables? Ah? Yes, well, happy day to you all. I hope this all finds you doing well and prepare yourself for those holiday leftovers so that you get a big belly. Speaking of big bellies, a statement was sent in from Texas and the statement goes as follows. My husband is a belly dump semi truck driver in Athens, Texas. He was on State Route twelve fifty three heading towards a four way stop in Garden Valley. As he was driving around ten am on November eighteenth. Oh, that wasn't long ago. It was a clear, sunny morning and he looked over into a clearing near a wooded area and saw a dark harry man or something about two hundred feet from the road walking at a steady pace with arms swaying beside its body. The creature was about six foot tall or maybe a little taller. My husband was driving at about sixty miles an hour, but slow enough to get a really good look whatever it was. He didn't tell anyone at work because people really don't believe in these sightings. He just told me. The sighting was in Smith County, Texas. The clearing had about three foot tall of dead grass and dense woods. As it joined the clearing area. He didn't see any clothes on this creature, and it didn't seem to have anything in its hands. Unfortunately, there were no other cars or trucks near the area. He asked himself many times if he really saw what he saw, but it was a clear day and he still can't believe it after almost fifty years over the road trucking. This is the strangest thing he had ever seen. Again, this is quite fascinating to be an only witness with no other vehicles in the area. I am not familiar with the area, but again, it's an interesting account. When we come back, let's go galactic. You're listening to the big football hunt right here on the Sasquatch Experience. It's not Dockers, it's got Knockers. Hey, have you been to the squatch field site on the interweb that has it all? Introducing got knockers dot Org. Stop on buy for an intriguing story of the encounter that started at all. But wait, there's more. Got Knockers offers some fabulous merchandise like T shirts, hoodies, onesies for the baby, plus a stunning array of jewelry and some fantastic sauces that will make your taste buds dance. But the coolest of all is a genuine God Knockers tree knocker. Stop on by and say hi to the folks of Got Knockers Gwendolyn and Michael Purcell, get in on the action and just visit Got Knockers Dot Org again Got Knockers dot o RG. Well, now January is coming up pretty quick on us, folks, and that means skulatch Fest meets Galacticfest. This event takes place on January thirtieth and thirty first of twenty twenty six at the Cowlitz County Events in Longview, Washington. It combines bigfoot research and merchandise with a galactic theme featuring speaker Cliff Barrickman. You can find more details and ticket information via Kelso K E Lso Longview Chamber of Commerce, or just go to the squatch Fest Facebook page. Thanks again for listening to this edition of the Bigfoot Bullhorn right here on Anomalous Entertainment's Sasquatch Experience. And as James always says to Matt at the end of each show, until we meet again, keep your toe in the mind. All right, Welcome. That was an interesting face to come back to, was it? Okay, kind of well, thank you Vance for the bigfoot bull horn this week. And while we were on break, you know, Kurt and the chat posted. I wonder if they got any updates in the State College sighting. We wish they would have done it better in terms of just announcing it to the public. Most likely messed up the area, you know, Kurt, that's a big problem that Matt and I have run into because when you start taking sightings and posting more precise locations, they just get inundated with people wanting to go out there and being excited because there was a recent bigfoot siding. But it makes it harder for those of us that actually do investigate. And I drove through there about two and a half three weeks ago at this point, around the same time as the sighting, and you know, it's a busy road, it really is. So I again, I don't put a lot of validity into the siding, but it doesn't mean I'm going to write it off. Hopefully the folks that were driving the other vehicle, perhaps they come forward and hearing some of the because that that article was shared so many times about these stories, that hopefully they come forward and if anybody else saw anything, they can provide more detail. But that area we got activity reported to us earlier in the year, around the end of spring, beginning of summer. And I'm trying to recall that's why my eyes are closed. Are I didn't develop a palsy or anything. And ah, damn it. We're gonna try to do more in that area. But I don't know. I get leery only because of you know, how popular the area could become to people, like or is it worth it? Or do we let it settle for a little while and then come back a little later, right, And it's a fear I have that what we're doing with the A and F. You know, when we did anytime we do a show and we started talking about these areas, we're going to. The A and F is an our area that's open to everybody, right, it's a national forest. And bigfooters do take their research areas a little personally because they spend a lot of time and cultivate these places. But it's a fear that I have when we start talking about locations we're going that other people might want to go, and you know, research demand up disturbing more than they're helping. So I don't know, it's half. A you know, right, go ahead, James, I would I would say is then what I would say is if some place became popular and you were worried about critical evidence currently excuse. Me, I had it worked in there. I had to get rid of all my oh boy, we'll get rid of the post. So I think that if you have an area that's critical to where you want to research, and you know that it's a hotspot, like and for the next six months it's going to be a hotspot, that's where you kind of dive into the local legends and some of the artifacts, some of the previous sightings and things like that. That way, then you have a base to kind of narrow down where you want to look while everybody else is trumping around. Well, so we did that in clear Field, and we did that in the A and F exactly what you're talking about, and we were really able to kind of shelter our principal research areas away. I just think it gets. Harder and harder and harder to do with the technology becoming better able to narrow down places and the context clues that we give when we do these things, that it you know, we just start making those We're instead of having a wide net we've cast over this area, we're starting to make it a lot easier. So I don't know, it's the catch twenty two. Because we want to get that information out there, we want to share it with people. We want people to be excited about the continuing mystery and let people know that there's activity happening and going on. The church is happening. But at the same time, are we hurting ourselves in the process. Probably probably we are. Well, unless you come across some solid evidence, you know, which is possible. It's possible you can find some amazing evidence in that area. Describe to our listeners. What you mean by a n F the Allegheny National Forest, Okay, and that's a National forest and you know northern tier Pennsylvania and upstate New York. It is gorgeous, absolutely stunning, and it's just an area of a lot of activity and it's not a sex You're not gonna The problem is to get to the areas that we go to, you really need to know the A and F. So do I really do I really think that you know we're we're going to get a giveaway our honey holes. No, I just think we're going to make it easier for them to potentially be found. Mm hmm occurred. I didn't take that at all from what you said. Sorry, I talk a lot sometimes I don't mean to take when wean to get your guys a show. No, no, no, I think that I love the dialogue around it because I think you bring up some really good points there, And uh, it's a concern I've always had and Vance and Baker, I've said it on this show probably a hundred times now. We've created the world's greatest guides to hoking, hoking hooking, and uh, it's it's it's the risk you take when you're doing shows like this to put the information out there right, no way around it, and all of us that do podcasts are guilty of. But unless you're just those shows that talk about scary made up bigfoot encounters but. Even a blind squirrel finds and. Nun't think they do. But that's okay. I think they bring interest into the subject. I don't think they give a realistic idea of what big footings like or what the creature could potentially be like. I think it does a lot to enhance fear, which sells horror cells. Yes, and that's that's what their purpose is. Cheap clicks. Right, It's like ghost hunters and things like that. A lot of that has to do with how tight the shirt you can get on the curl and how high she can scream. Good personnel, what your ratings are. But the fact is, though, is wow, they show a lot of stuff that if somebody make a ghost sighting, even though you know it's basked. I loved Mountain Monsters, but we all knew they were making stuff up as they went. I mean, they would admit. To it, you know. I mean, you need to tell me that the man right, Yes, But but the thing is is that they knew it. They took it at that camp. But at the same time is if you watch the shows, they were smart men. They knew stuff and they showed you different things. It's like I watch a lot of these videos like Fat Guys in the Woods, Mountain Monsters, a lot of these are they teach you stuff. Oh my god, we need money for that, and Fat Guys in the Wood that was us you me? And at first I guess I would ask, right, I guess I would ask. Then on that comment, what shows have been put out there that are the most reliable or most believable? Oh, Alaskan Killer Bigfoot? Okay, I couldn't even say that with a straight face. You're kidding me. You know, Finding Bigfoot tried, and I think they. What they do a million dollars was probably different than how it was edited too, Do you know what I'm saying. Yes, Like editing goes into a lot of it, and that's not necessarily under control the. People that are filming this stuff, right, right, or the intention of those that are putting the project together. Right? I agree? I think there was some Yeah. No, I think Finding Bigfoot was really good. Monster Quest was skirted that infotainment line, right because they talked about a lot of different topics through monster Quests. But the Bigfoot episodes were pretty top notch and they just kind of retold the stories. You know, I would say on the Monster Quest the aspect of the episode, I don't remember what the episode was called that involved doctor Meldrum when the rocks are being thrown at the cabin up in Canada. Yes, yeah, attack, I think is what it was. Yeah. Yeah, that had a lot of credibility to it. We were talking to Doug Haischik about Snowgrove Lake and. We were talking to I believe so, Bake. I think you and I were talking to Meldrum off. We weren't. We were just at an event somewhere. We were just standing off to the side talking to doctor Meldrim about snow Grove. Lake and still amazing. Man. You have to. You know that area is more remote than people realize. And I know there's people saying, well, there's another village so and so far away. Great, okay, yeah village what three? Yeah, Okay, that's fine. What's the likelihood of them coming out there for rocks at somebody? And why? Right? You also have to recognize the oh sorry, this one's right. Up your alley, James. I honestly don't know the best one. Did you guys ever watch The Naked and Afraid where they found a cowie nest and had to sign where they were around so not to sign where they were aren't around to say anything about it. I did not see that one, but Vance and Baker, you guys seem to know about that one a little bit. I heard about it. I don't believe I watched it the entire episode. Yeah, yeah, I was not familiar with that. But Naked and Afraid is a good show. Alone is another good one. Alone is good and alone though alone is another one of those shows that teaches you things, right because like they make a cabin at enughing. You know, I had, I had an axe and some sticks and I've a you know, a four story summer home. Yeah. Well, and again I think it goes into you know, finding that any show like that that gives you a perspective of the outdoors, I think is imperative to watch. Even though they do get an idea of a little sensationalized uh that, you do get a lot of information from them. It does. It does keep your ass in the seat, You're right, But I think it also gives you a good information too and makes it interesting. And I'll tell you I've learned so much, uh, you know, watching shows about bears and other animals. That has built my confidence being out in the woods. Uh, you know quite a bit. I know, somebody just put in there, you know, go for a hike. We spend more time out in the woods than you realize. Pal Uh, don't let the fat fool you. We also like barbecue, so that's the other downpoint. But you know, building my. Comfort up around yeah, is done from learning about known animals. Like we jokingly talk about rattle snakes, and I had a paralyzing fear of snakes. And you still do ye, You've still gotten over it for the most and. You know, how you educate yourself and learn more about the animals and why they react the way they do, you start getting a little bit more comfortable with the idea of them sharing. You know, you sharing their space because you're invading their territory and you respect them and leave them alone and don't poke and prod at them. You're probably going to be left alone. So anytime you can immerse yourself with something natural or learning about the natural world, I think as a win. When there's an entertainment aspect to it, you have to question a lot of it, but I still think it's the Merit is worth watching. But then it leads you into other things, like I just picked up this book ouch that was a chair because Baker was watching some of them. Baker was following a guy on social media and we asked him to come on the show and he said, it's not really what he does, but I ended up buying his book called Essential Wilderness Navigation, How to learn to navigate without all these tools and everything. So you know, there's a sciety element there. And this is just. Networking with other outdoors people. So anytime we can connect and bring somebody into this world and take something we're learning, that's a win. And it doesn't have to be just cryptozoological related. It could be any kind of science or natural exploration, right, exploration that helps bring us along. Right. Well, No, that's very helpful, you know. And I've learned a lot from my eldest brother, who taught me a lot because he spends so much more time in the wilderness than I did. And it's called wisdom. You spend enough time in that area, or in any wilderness area, you start to gather information what to do and what not to do, and then that information gets passed on to a younger generation like myself. And then I picked that up, and I pick up wisdom of other things. Two, you know, stay away from So go ahead, bake. You were going to say something there, well, vans bankes h A great point is we used to sell cameras to people and people will always say I'm too old to learn the technology. I'm too old to do this, right, I just don't want to. I said, okay, what do you want to do? And then they want to, Oh, they want to go out in the woods and find Bigfoot. Okay, first let's start with go out in the woods about the things like that. And the thing is is but here's the thing. What happens is is you go out in the woods and and this happened to me, and this happened to Sean when we when we got land. Was you realize that it opens up questions like okay, I noticed there's a track here, what kind of animal could this? Then you start learning about deer and bear. Then that answers other questions, and then you look across the thing like we we were hearing voices, not the ones in my head, but real voices. Well we thought they were real, and so we tried. We couldn't figure out where they were coming from. So over the next two weeks, me and him independently are like learning about how voices project, where they could come from in different angles. And then the next time we heard the voice, go all right, man, we know it's not coming from over here because the reflections from over there and it could be that lady down the block down there, because it could have cared. But we knew individual things about voices and different kinds of way people communicate. And then we found out there was an old Indian there was an Indian battle site right where my land is that the local college had been doing it. But we learned all these individual things. Was started with let's get some land and do you know and makes it? Yeah? You compile all that information together right right? Well, and again we know and. Instead of jumping to conclusions, we researched and eliminated what it could be. Right And now, I mean, you know, the creepy thing about is we were standing there, he and I were in two different areas of the land, and we were hearing what we thought was chatter and we couldn't identify what was coming from. And so after weeks and weeks of this, you know, he comes up, Hey, by the way, this is what I just son of a bitch like it? You know it. We narrated where it wasn't We narrated what it couldn't have been. We realized you couldn't have been this. We were at one end of the land, at one point and we heard this large whatever and we're like, what is that? Was that? Then we walked over and there were trees that are of the tree just fell over, and I said, okay, well, okay, that's a that's nature taking its course, or it's just. Fell out of the tree. The yard of deduction. Yes, chestnut hit chestnut hit a metal roof, you know. Like but you the more like mister hiker guy, the more you're out there, the more you are susceptible to hearing and seeing things are true because you have a knowledge of what's false. How many times people think that there's stuff being thrown at them, but it's really just stuff falling out of a tree. Yeah, well I had stuff thrown at me and it didn't just fall out of a tree. So I have used on that, right I did. And you know what, it didn't come from It didn't come immediately. It came years later. And that's the thing as to what happened with my brother and myself. You know, we had pine cones thrown at us and we were in a clear fire break. We were in the center of a fire break and we had stuff thrown at it. And I'll go through that story some other point. But what we heard sounded like a t rex romping through the forest. And then have these pine cones, you know, those pine cones that are not fully exposed yet. They're like a cigar. They look like a turd. Yes, they look like a And one was thrown at me, and one was thrown at my brother. The one that was thrown at my brother hit them in the back of the head. The one that was thrown at me flew over my head. But that did not fall from trees from above us. It just did not. And I knew nothing about this subject at the time. Well nothing. If we can't get a guest for the next show, I think that's worth the merit of us talking about our strange encounters, because I think we've had some interesting things happen out there that, you know, we don't really associate with bigfoot or could be Bigfoot that we just didn't talk about. I've got turd coats. I had a friend of mine they called them egg tones. I'm like, an egg cone, what is that? Anybody? You mean? An egg corn and a pine cone? Buddy Jimmy over at oh boy, oh boy, turd cones? Yeap. So let's take a piece of evidence that a lot of people say it's not plausible. How can an animal move through the woods one hundred yards or even at a quarter a mile without making a lot of sound and no one noticing. I will give you a perfect example. I was digging a hole four feet by six feet buddy liner in a classic liner in for a pawd. Okay, I'm sweating, I'm moving dirt. I'm a fat guy at like almost dying, but need to get it done because nobody else is helping me. Because my other friend was his days are different. Now, Okay, I had three deer in my vicinity. One of them was standing over my shoulder. The other two were at the other end. They chose to move in a certain way for me to hear them, but I never heard them creep up on me. That was making I guess I was making reasonable noise, but it wasn't whatever. But the thing is, no, you're natural right when you're not trying to focus on the quiet, these things could sneak up on you anywhere. That's like they always talk about predators like lions and type. Right, how did nobody see you? You just tiger come at you? Because it knows how to move when you're not attention. Yep, absolutely, And Baker, you hit the nail on the head. How many times have we just been there and all of a sudden we look up and there's another animal. There's a deer, there's a fox, there's something standing there that wasn't there a little while ago. Now I didn't hear it. Hell, bears can move and not make a hell of a lot of noise. No, no, I totally agree. Sometimes you don't really realize something's there until it's right up on you, and then you've got I. Had a bear comb up on me up in on Terror, Canada. I didn't see it until it was standing no more than eight feet in front of me and stood up on inside legs. I didn't hear it approaching me, not at all. And here it comes up standing at I was like, oh crap, and all I've got to defend myself is my car keys. That was it. I've got this story that when Matt and I were up in Elk County and we're driving through the research area and we happened to drive by and I thought I saw a glimpse of something large and hairy standing alongside the road and I said, holy shit, what was that? And then we backed up and there were seven elk standing there right like if I hadn't just caught that out of my peripheral like we. Drove, yeah, you would have never known. We were right there in the clearing man and so. And I've got great and I don't let the glasses for you, like you know, Matt calls me eagle eye because I've got a good eye for picking stuff up. We were just so ingrained in what we were doing and having conversation. It didn't catch us. Uh, you know it. We didn't catch it. And so that stuff happens more often than than not. Uh. And it's just one more of those natural phenomenas, like there's so much bake that leads credence to this creature aside from sightings being a realistic animal, and the behaviors of it aren't necessarily any different than known animals that are that are out there now. Mm hm. I guess the best way would be to test that theory would be is you'd have to find somebody like Jane Goodall, Oh, I mean, somebody alive, but you know, have to pick some And that's why I used to love Meldrum and some of the other ones. Is they studied apes because when they found was is could an ape move one hundred yards and nobody noticed? Yes? And this. Could what you're thinking, And then you study that because you can see that. You know, if you if you think it's a large lizard, look at small lizards and see, you know, just double the recipe. I guess you know, Kurt posted. Every time I think of cryptids or ets, I think about how they move and not make any noise, but the cloaking and the eyes, I always think we're they were telling us something like in the Predator movies. Listen, and we're starting to get accounts of this thing that lawn Strickler is calling the shimmer. Man, of these. Kind of cloaked beings that people are seeing out in the out in the wilderness. I don't know how much art to put into it, but folks are starting to observe this phenomena. You know, again, is that something that's paranormal or is that something that has an ability to really blend in with this environment. We were talking to somebody not long ago and they were, you know, the hairs and the translucent hair follicles, right, that was something that is something we need to study and look into more unnaturally. Yeah, we'll talk about that at some point in a future show, I think, so. I agree, But I think that's pretty much wind us up to the night. Any final thoughts from you, guys, Hey, we're almost burned through this hour. Wow, that was fast. I said it was bigfoot and bullshit and bears, and we talked about all three. Yeah, we didn't talk much about bears, but you know, we'll talk about the polar bear that the hairs are The hairs on a polar bear are actually translucent and its skin is actually black. But that's what helps it to survive. So there you go. See, animals have incredible abilities to survive in their environments, and they can move, uh, rather silently. You might have a bear with a very large paw, but I'm sorry, but the larger the paw, the quieter it can move. Well. However, here a lot of the stories, the guy didn't see the bar till he's up on top of it. Then you're at a disadvant I don't care if you're caring commando with. A commando knife, going commando. Ship myself. Yeah, all right, right, folks. On that note, I want to thank you all for tuning in. I'm sure, thank you everyone. That's Vance Nesbitt, He's James Baker. Uh. Again, we want to thank h you guys for tuning in. We wish Vance or we wish Henry and uh Matt Matt Erner to get better, ask some luck, and to be safe and we will see you guys in two weeks. Thanks for listening to us Babylon the night. Enjoy your turkey, Babylon, I know that place. Enjoy yourselves this week. Be safe. I have a wonderful thanksgiving everyone, and keep on. Make sure you're that sucker out because when you go reaching up for them giblets, if it's frozen, it should. Have it should have been. Wow, you should be there. You should have been putting that turkey in the fridge yesterday. Yeah, you should have you. Hey, hey, you learn a lot when you try to put your hand up the fridgeid crevice. And don't forget. You've been listening to The Sasquatch Experience. Please rate and review wherever this podcast is consumed. For more information, please. Go to our website, Sasquatch Experience dot com. Keep on spatching,